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Hong Kong shares close sharply higher
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| Junior Member |
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| 1496 Posts |
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| posted by Nasdaq_Index 167 days ago |
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Today, with hopes that the US credit market is in the way for a recovery (magical). Some of the HK blue chips rose significantly today and I hope that people reduced some of their positions by unloading some of their holdings. I personally closed all my long position and bought put warrants on HKEX and HSBC.
Since this is my first week trading out of HSBC account, i found it so difficult to view and place order quickly, no short cuts/hyperlinks. I had to log into my AAStocks check out the underlying security, search for the warrant, then go back to HSBC and place the order as I would do it for an equity stock...it was fooking frustrating but I eventually bought all my puts at the close since I feel that this is just one of those quick rallies where most people fall for. I also noticed sell blocks trade dumped right before the market closes. I suspect that these are some of the funds trying to lock in some profits on today’s rally.
Anyone here beside AX trade warrants? which one have you been looking at?
on a side note, BOC was up 8% ahead of earning (Today), there are expected to have net profit of 43.35 bln to 52.09 bln yuan for 2007, up 1.2 to 21.6 pct from 42.83 bln achieved a year earlier
also watch out for Chinese airlines companies, they can be very promising if mergers can be materialized.
Remember! Respect is Earned not Given =)
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| Regular Member |
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| 4996 Posts |
| of trenchancy |
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| posted by smog 167 days ago |
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I'm still happily in HSBC - for me it's a long term hold, although it's nice to be up about 5% overall in addition to the imminent dividends.
SensexETF up 12% today :-) I was thinking about buying more of that last week but chickened out, which is a shame really.
Warrants requires more time and analysis than I'm prepared to put into it I'm afraid.
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http://smogsblog.wordpress.com for more of the same
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| Junior Member |
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| 1496 Posts |
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| posted by Nasdaq_Index 167 days ago |
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i was very long last week...... Seriously long, but I was expecting a small rally as we haven’t seen one since Jan 23rd. Personally I like shorting stocks directly, warrant trading are not very complicated, what’s complicated is to have good tools to trade them. So far neither HSBC nor AAST has a well comprehensive tool -comparing to Ameritrade or Scott trade in the US-
When I called HSBC earlier, the client service person claimed that she does understand warrants well, and all i was asking her is where I can see the strike price and the conversion ratio to get my beta exposure...
Remember! Respect is Earned not Given =)
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| Regular Member |
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| 5075 Posts |
| Sweating |
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| Australia |
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| posted by xpat-Aussie 167 days ago |
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Mate, go to www.warrants.com then click on the HK/English link. It's run by SG (who happen to be the best market makers in this town bar none) and has some very useful info. There's a lag for the prices etc, but for strike, maturity calcs, it's pretty useful, especially if you base your trading decisions on daily charts (which I do), as you can make your trade targets at night, without the distraction of watching instraday charts (which tend to make me deviate from my plan).
I can't beleive I closed all my positions last week. If only I held those puts til 3:45 today :)
Had to wind down the trades, as I'm simply too busy this week with the movers coming on Friday.
I agree that this is a bull trap, though it might last a week or three. We can go a fair bit higher without breaking the overall down trend, so I'm still quite bearish for the first half of the year. I haven't checked, but I reckon there is a lot of short covering going on all over the planet this week :)
Nas, have you tried the local brokerages? Boom.com I think is alright. You can set up a margin account with them, and I "think" they have plenty of stocks to "borrow" for direct shorting too. HSBC brokerage is hopeless, but it'll do for most "investors". You might also try optionsexpress out of Singapore, or e-trade etc...
"...and once you have tasted flight,
you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward,
for there you have been and there you long to return...."
-Leonardo DaVinci
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| Regular Member |
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| 4996 Posts |
| of trenchancy |
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| posted by smog 167 days ago |
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I'd still like to know what your overall long-run return is with all this effort you put into day-trading. Do you really beat the long-run invest and hold of 8-10%?
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http://smogsblog.wordpress.com for more of the same
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| Junior Member |
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| 1496 Posts |
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| posted by Nasdaq_Index 167 days ago |
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quote:
Originally posted by smog
I'd still like to know what your overall long-run return is with all this effort you put into day-trading. Do you really beat the long-run invest and hold of 8-10%?
>10% can be one day Smog.
Being a day a trader is a discipline itself, you set goals to yourself and once those goals are met then you should get out. You can do this in two ways, set a side a capital for your buy and hold/long term investment which can be 12-24 months and set a side another sum for day trading.
Day trading is all about watching 2-3 names which usually are very volatile across various industries so you can always make money on correlation effect. This will also allow you to constantly hedge your long term portfolio. Today was my second trade since I arrived Hong Kong, and I still have to learn a lot about the local mkt since I really didn’t deal with the liquid mkt at all in my previous job. Having said this, there are always ways to make a quick buck and day trading is one of them. Buying some of the blue ships today and closing before the end of day would’ve made you a nice amount of cash, the only thing I would advise if you need to have balls and discipline to day trade. I sold out all my longs, shorted HSBC and HKEX heavily today and my have to take a hit tomorrow (unrealized PnL of course) but we will keep shorting probably till end of the week.
Full time warrant/day traders close all their position daily and sleep peacefully.
Remember! Respect is Earned not Given =)
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| Regular Member |
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| 5075 Posts |
| Sweating |
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| Australia |
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| posted by xpat-Aussie 167 days ago |
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First, I wouldn't call it "day trading", considering we're in a bear market, I do tend to hold positions for a fairly short amount of time, but only because of the sentiment and overall trend (ie: DOWN). My overall gain YTD is in the vicinity of 20%. That's overall. Of the money I've set aside for agressive trading (which is where I've made most of my gains), I'm closer to 100% YTD. Mind you, I've been very lucky to be on the right side of almost all of these violent swings we've had except for todays.
Now if only I had more than HK$125 to trade, I'd be doing alright! 
I haven't been doing this long enough to state that I can beat 8-10% consistantly, but if I didn't buy another stock/derivative all year, I'd obviously kill that figure. I'll talk to you about any of this in person... the willy waver accusations are gunna start flying again as soon as I press submit
I've no idea why people think we're talking about significant sums of money here, if they knew, they'd look down with pitty 
"...and once you have tasted flight,
you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward,
for there you have been and there you long to return...."
-Leonardo DaVinci
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| Regular Member |
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| 5075 Posts |
| Sweating |
| in |
| Australia |
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| posted by xpat-Aussie 167 days ago |
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quote:
Originally posted by Nasdaq_Index
Full time warrant/day traders close all their position daily and sleep peacefully.
Tell me about it... though even though I own nothing at this time, I'll not sleep tonight for over of the profits I could have been making!
"...and once you have tasted flight,
you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward,
for there you have been and there you long to return...."
-Leonardo DaVinci
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| Junior Member |
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| 1496 Posts |
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| posted by Nasdaq_Index 167 days ago |
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Well, I loaded up for the first time on put warrants (wish me luck mate) in 2.5yrs, and this time is with my OWN money!!! No one should touch or come near derivatives/warrants unless you have the stomach to digest the volatility. Don’t get me wrong, there are not complex, you would just end up with a VAR which is another way to show your risk appetite.
I personally would prefer trading stock option (American style) rather than warrants, but we have no options in HK. btw I called Boom and others, no one offers short selling out of their inventory.
Remember! Respect is Earned not Given =)
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| Regular Member |
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| 5075 Posts |
| Sweating |
| in |
| Australia |
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| posted by xpat-Aussie 167 days ago |
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I too prefer options, but there's no real trade here (very little anyways), but warrants are very similar, but with less sophisticated trading strategies available. Expiry, Implied volitility, days to maturity etc all play the same role. The good thing about warrants though (theoretically) is that the market maker *must* provide liquidity for their warrants. Some are much better than others, so all other things being fairly equal, I'll always choose SG (Sociate Generale) as they are very active market makers, and you're never left hot or cold with poor bid/ask spreads.
Also, ignore those bullsih/bearish block trades that you'll see listed in your trading window. Often they're just the market maker changing the bid/ask and at the same time trying to inflate their volume to suck in inexperienced traders... dirty bastards! :)
"...and once you have tasted flight,
you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward,
for there you have been and there you long to return...."
-Leonardo DaVinci
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| Junior Member |
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| 1173 Posts |
| in |
| Hong Kong |
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| posted by Craic 166 days ago |
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I tend to buy KBC or BNP warrants as they are most liquid..... dont hold your warrants for too long, in my opinion, they are purely day trade or maybe taking a punt overnight on direction of the market.
Nas, you can trade stock options in HK, but only european style, but it's tend to be more expensive as vol is calculate higher and it's not as liquid, but I suppose it will not affect much to a small investor.
If ya dont want it, dont maul it!!!!
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| Junior Member |
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| 1496 Posts |
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| posted by Nasdaq_Index 165 days ago (edited 165 days ago) |
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I think I would stick with warrant for now, i have been buying put warrant on HKEX and HSBC for the past two days (during the bull trap)....its paying off today.
Depending how the day goes, I may keep them till tomorrow.
Remember! Respect is Earned not Given =)
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